New 3rd level orcish units

[benj]

MAybe we should try to create a 2nd or 3rd level variation for grunt path.

I'm thinking about two possibilities:

- as kilder & christophe33 proposed, a kind of heavy infantry unit ;

- a kind of trapper : less damage and less HP than Orcish Warrior, but quicker and with a ranged weapon.

I can work on statistics if either ideas sounds good.

[Dave]

Although I would love to have more units for the game, I would really encourage people to devote energy to finishing off animations of all current units.

I'm not going to say people "can't" work on new units, or that I'll refuse to accept them, but I would like to get current units complete at some point

David

[Dobob]

i'm counting with the idea exposed somewhere else of a goblin with a banner who would be a lvl 0 possibly (according to Dobob scale, they shouldn't be fighting )

Sorry , that wasn't clear, I meant unit that aren't fighter/soldier/whatever. Thus the peasant example.

To Benj :
If orcs should have elite archers could be discussed, but I see orcish archers much like semi-slaves troops who are forced into war by the grunts. Also, orcs don't have any natural talents bow-wise, this being the reason why their archers aren't very good. So it would be very hard for them to reach the elite status as they would need skills that they just can get (but this argument is very weak).


About lower level giving leadership, would it be easy to add a new "bard" or "banner" skill that would give a leadership-like bonus (cumulative with the real leadership) to all adjacent units of the same race, regardless of the level. Such a skill could be given to a banner-carrier.

[Guest]

Maybe orc should not be given any crossbow at all since they are rather complex weapon that need a lot of care to work well (and orcs are rather carelesss). small/medium bows would be good enough.

Now that you mention it, I must admit that this surprised me a lot, too. Orcs are not as advanced as to build their own crossbows. They are raiders who steal weapons and armors from merchants. Or who buy them with stolen gold somewhere. Maybe they have human slaves who make weapons for them. Orcs would throw knifes, love sabre-like weapons, have lots of spears and bows with unprecise arrows and wear leather armor and wooden shields.

[benj]

If orcs should have elite archers could be discussed, but I see orcish archers much like semi-slaves troops who are forced into war by the grunts. Also, orcs don't have any natural talents bow-wise, this being the reason why their archers aren't very good. So it would be very hard for them to reach the elite status as they would need skills that they just can get (but this argument is very weak).

Well, there are many interpretations of orcish society. But a lot are based on fantasy and sci-fi stories, where orcs are on the bad side and where they are depicted from human or elvish points of view. As you always see your enemy as a semi beast, this is why orcs are seens as boors.

After all, American Indians thought colons practiced cannibalism because they have never seen pork meat before. This is the same here, incomprehension always lead to underestimate your enemy.

But to my opinion, orcish culture is rich and although orcish values are aggressive and very different from human point of vue, orcs are capable of mastering skills they need. Thus, bow experts are not that surprising. Even Tolkien write stories where humans fear orcish arrows.

[Christophe33]

In Tolkien books, orcs are actually competant blacksmith and make efficient if ugly looking weapon. I have no problem with them having bows witch are fairly easy to make. Complex crossbow require the cooperation of different craftmen to work out both the wood frame, the steel blade and the mechanism for the lever. While they still might be able to make it, it's a heavvy and incovenient weapon requiring care to stay accurate. Orcs are usually consider to be direct and impatient, so why should they bother if they can have a somewhat decent range weapon with the bow.
Again, this is a rather minor point and we can consider that the orcs in this word have developped or copied th blueprint for crossbow and enjoy using it because it doesn't require as much dexterity as a bow.
In other word, we can argue endlessly about it .